Should "god" be taken out of our nations sayings?

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the lakes slave		#161	[-]
Posts: 61835 (05/25/2009 10:22 AM) Reply Quote More Recent Posts Message Friend Block Invite Ignore	Love each other, treat others the way you want to be treated, don't kill, don't cheat, don't steal, don't covet, honor you parents, do not judge...yeah, why would anyone want to follow the teachings of Christianity. I think it's funny that people need a book and a voice from the sky to tell them it's fucking stupid to kill and cheat and steal. Shouldn't the people who figure this out themselves be the good ones? One of the stupidest beliefs of SOME religious people is that religious = moral. I'm sure all those Catholic priests feel the same way. Edited By: the lakes slave 05/25/2009 10:29 AM. Edited 1 times.
Bee		#162	[-]
Posts: 344 (05/25/2009 10:54 AM) Reply Quote More Recent Posts Message Friend Block Invite Ignore	I'm not religious and I'm gonna say no. It's always been there and when I read it I just think it proves that people still believe, not just in God but in other things like miracles, etc.
rachaelthinksbeesareokay		#163	[-]
Posts: 2058 (05/25/2009 1:11 PM) Grammar Cop '09 Reply Quote More Recent Posts Message Friend Block Invite Ignore	Lideem wrote: MandsLB8 wrote: Never once did I say that you should say them along with me. My reply to the thread was in response to the OP's original question. And I said, I don't care if it is or if it isn't, because I'll always say it. But you realize the words weren't originally there, right? You make it sound like you write "In God We Trust" on store coupons and sing "Oh, god! can you see by the dawn's early light." I have a more practical question... if you still say it in the Pledge won't you be three syllables behind everybody else? Won't that get confusing? Won't people get to the end and wonder why you're still talking?
rokhas1yummybumbum		#164	[-]
Posts: 14053 (05/25/2009 1:24 PM) Reply Quote More Recent Posts Message Friend Block Invite Ignore	Semirhage626 wrote: rokhas1yummybumbum wrote: Semirhage626 wrote: Dylishis wrote: For the people who don't believe, yes they are just empty words, but religion in this country is still affecting them because of the people who continue to try to legislate and make laws based on those religious beliefs i.e. dumbfuck Bush etc. That's why they care. Oh, absolutely but I think it's misguided attentions look to things like money and the Pledge of Allegiance to make an argument about basic human rights. I know that many Christians are very firm in their beliefs and they may try to force that on the whole in situations that they have no right to do so but taking God out of our documents and money isn't going to change those rabid Bible thumpers' stance on anything (politicians and otherwise). I think focusing on those areas that need fixing and working harder to force fair legislation on more important things is a better idea than erasing the word God from dollar bills and national oaths. If God is gone, are these people suddenly going to hop the fence and believe what those the non-believers do? Of course not. No, it's just a simple change and it won't make things better overnight. But on the other hand, it IS just a small thing, and so it should be something we can manage to change, because it is just words, and words are easier to change than attitudes. And there is no good reason to have government documents and currency that intentionally sets out to alienate a large group of people -- and that is exactly what the inclusion of Under God in the pledge set out to do when it was added in the 50's. Every American should be able to say the Pledge without being reminded that they're in a religious minority. Do you feel alienated? Do you feel guilty? I don't know why, if you were comfortable in your disbelief in God, you'd care at all. My dad is an atheist and he doesn't feel alienated. You are an idiot, that is not the point at all. I am quite comfortable with my belief system. I could just as easily say if Christians were comfortable in their belief of God, they wouldn't need to cling to secular mentions of him. My point is that the inclusion of Under God violates our Constitutional principles, it was put in during the 50's to alienate atheists as communists, and it also violates the tenets of Christianity, so there is really no valid reason for it to stay. Yeah the Constitution has been dead for awhile, so saying it's unconstitutional and that is why it upsets you is a poor argument. It's not stopping you from doing anything. It isn't forcing you to believe anything. I can think of many other things that are unconstitutional and that do violate people's rights though. And removing God from our money and the pledge should be the very least of your worries as an atheist. I can think of a few other places where the church/religion blends with the state, and atheists don't seem to mind.
subpar		#165	[-]
Posts: 308 (05/25/2009 1:44 PM) Reply Quote More Recent Posts Message Friend Block Invite Ignore	honestly, i used to think it should stay in the pledge, but it really it has no place in the pledge.
Semirhage626		#166	[-]
Posts: 6456 (05/25/2009 1:52 PM) Reply Quote More Recent Posts Message Friend Block Invite Ignore	Yeah the Constitution has been dead for awhile, so saying it's unconstitutional and that is why it upsets you is a poor argument. It's not stopping you from doing anything. It isn't forcing you to believe anything. I can think of many other things that are unconstitutional and that do violate people's rights though. Wow. That's one of the most disturbing things I've ever read on JJB. Just because the Constitution has been distorted, doesn't mean I won't continue to fight for the values I believe this nation should uphold. I never said this was my top concern. It is one of the least of my worries, but this is an internet discussion board, so it's a pretty minor place to take up the fight. I do have larger concerns when I spend time lobbying my Congressmen -- but just because it is a minor concern is no reason to dismiss is or not partake in the discussion. It's the fricking internet. And don't assume that I "don't seem to mind" when it comes to other areas of church/state involvement, I probably do. And again, if it's so minor, then why do people fight to keep it? If it's so minor, it'd take 5 seconds to fix. We re design our money all the time, we are about to have to redesign it again to comply with ADA rules. It took about 15 minutes to put Under God in the pledge, it would take about 15 minutes to right that historical wrong. It has NOT always been there.
the lakes slave		#167	[-]
Posts: 61838 (05/25/2009 2:03 PM) Reply Quote More Recent Posts Message Friend Block Invite Ignore	Wow. That's one of the most disturbing things I've ever read on JJB. Don't listen to rokhas. She's sort of a whackadoodle libertarian.
Semirhage626		#168	[-]
Posts: 6458 (05/25/2009 2:06 PM) Reply Quote More Recent Posts Message Friend Block Invite Ignore	No respectable Libertarian could ever defend Under God and trash Constitutional values the way rokhas is . . . that's almost even more disturbing.
Shunda84		#169	[-]
Posts: 3521 (05/25/2009 2:15 PM) Reply Quote More Recent Posts Message Friend Block Invite Ignore	I am a Christian but guess what? I don't give two flying shits what's on money. I don't sit down to read or analyze what's on a piece of paper that I won't have for more than a week. It's not that serious guys! It's just money. This isn't the sign of the Apocalypse!
DoesThatSparkle		#170	[-]
Posts: 2215 (05/25/2009 5:06 PM) Reply Quote More Recent Posts Message Friend Block Invite Ignore	Semirhage626 wrote: No respectable Libertarian could ever defend Under God and trash Constitutional values the way rokhas is . . . that's almost even more disturbing. You should check out some of rohkas other posts! They're just as entertaining and will give you a little insight on what you're arguing against.
rokhas1yummybumbum		#171	[-]
Posts: 14056 (05/25/2009 5:29 PM) Reply Quote More Recent Posts Message Friend Block Invite Ignore	Semirhage626 wrote: Yeah the Constitution has been dead for awhile, so saying it's unconstitutional and that is why it upsets you is a poor argument. It's not stopping you from doing anything. It isn't forcing you to believe anything. I can think of many other things that are unconstitutional and that do violate people's rights though. Wow. That's one of the most disturbing things I've ever read on JJB. Just because the Constitution has been distorted, doesn't mean I won't continue to fight for the values I believe this nation should uphold. I never said this was my top concern. It is one of the least of my worries, but this is an internet discussion board, so it's a pretty minor place to take up the fight. I do have larger concerns when I spend time lobbying my Congressmen -- but just because it is a minor concern is no reason to dismiss is or not partake in the discussion. It's the fricking internet. And don't assume that I "don't seem to mind" when it comes to other areas of church/state involvement, I probably do. And again, if it's so minor, then why do people fight to keep it? If it's so minor, it'd take 5 seconds to fix. We re design our money all the time, we are about to have to redesign it again to comply with ADA rules. It took about 15 minutes to put Under God in the pledge, it would take about 15 minutes to right that historical wrong. It has NOT always been there. Um where have I trashed Constitutional values? The majority of people no longer respect the Constitution. That isn't trashing Constitutional values...it's stating a sad fact. Most people pick and choose what they want to follow, when it fits their conveience. You must have never seen me post before this if you think I don't like the Constitution. FWIW, I don't care if it's there or not.
Semirhage626		#172	[-]
Posts: 6459 (05/25/2009 5:53 PM) Reply Quote More Recent Posts Message Friend Block Invite Ignore	I didn't say you didn't like the Constitution, but you say that being upset about something because it is Unconstitutional it is a "poor argument" The sentence I bolded, that you quoted above, shows a total disregard for Constitutional values. DoesThatSparkle -- thanks for enlightening me I'll save myself the trouble next time.
blairboy		#173	[-]
Posts: 33272 (05/25/2009 9:21 PM) Best Male JJBer '07 Best Debater '08 Current Events Scoop '09 Reply Quote More Recent Posts Message Friend Block Invite Ignore
shalom yall		#174	[-]
Posts: 6203 (05/25/2009 10:10 PM) Reply Quote More Recent Posts Message Friend Block Invite Ignore	Separation of church and state is something I am very passionate about. I currently live in a very conservative area where my local newspaper has a quote from the bible on the front page every day. I wrote a letter to the editor a few months ago dispelling the myth that our nation was founded on Christian principles and my family received threatening phone calls accusing me of being a "communist babykiller" and telling me to leave the country. We ended up having to call the police. That being said, I don't think God should be included in anything having to do with the government: license plates, money, the Pledge of Allegiance, etc. For most of high school I did not say "under God" in the Pledge and when I go back and visit my high school now I still don't say it. The presence of the word "God" may not be killing anyone, but it is alienating a good portion of the population that believes in multiple gods or no god at all. I personally believe in God but I would NEVER impose my belief on anyone else and that is what is being done, however indirectly or non-threateningly, every time it is printed on money or said in the Pledge, because it is saying "in God WE trust" and "one nation under God." In my opinion, the "need" to acknowledge God's existence on money and in our public schools is a sign of insecurity on the part of the believers.
Shunda84		#175	[-]
Posts: 3527 (05/25/2009 10:46 PM) Reply Quote More Recent Posts Message Friend Block Invite Ignore	blairboy wrote:

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